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Race Car Fabrication There is a lot of cool fabriaction going on the race car industry, show us what you got.


Race Car Fabrication There is a lot of cool fabriaction going on the race car industry, show us what you got.

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  #201  
Old 04-06-2015, 08:14 AM
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Graham08 Graham08 is offline
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Originally Posted by TheBandit View Post
You can get a HSS port tool for about $120 (-6 or -8) from Form Relief Tool Co:
http://cutters.formrelief.com/viewit...ontour-cutters That's roughly half the cost of the carbide-tipped version from Scientific Cutting Tools (I needed carbide for stainless). Having this kind of tool really opens up options for custom manifolding, port repairs, and whatnot, but it's an investment. I found myself using them all over the place once I had the tools, but I was also dealing in a manufacturing environment where maintenance, down time and lost product (catalyst coatings containing expensive precious metals) were very expensive. I also didn't deal as much with tanks where you need to add a bung anyway for thickness.
Thanks for the tip on a supplier for port tools. I'll eventually pick them up as required...just haven't gotten to that point yet. They're definitely an investment, but I can see how once you have them you would use them all the time.

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Originally Posted by Dqracer View Post
Awesome work and build project , radiators are beautiful ..
Thanks! Great to see you on here again. Did you ever get that bad-ass kart going?
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  #202  
Old 04-06-2015, 09:13 AM
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I made some more progress on the cooling system over the weekend. First was finishing up the header tank and getting it attached to the car.



I was able to reuse a hammerform I had made for another project to do the top and bottom, and used the slip roll to do the body of the tank. The bracket makes use of the steering support to position the tank where I can connect the bottom to the heater hose return port on the water pump.

The other thing I tackled was the upper and lower radiator "hoses". They're made out of aluminum tubing for the most part, and connect to the radiator using short pieces of silicone hose. The upper incorporates a manifold to transition from two -8 hoses coming out of the front of the injection to a single 1-1/2" tube:



The manifold part consists of two -8 male weld bungs that are welded to some short pieces of 1" x 0.0120" wall 6061 tube. They got merged together at a 60 degree angle and cut off so the width of the assembly was 1-1/2" to match the elbow. I hammered the elbow to fit the manifold closely and welded the whole thing up.

Here's another view:



The elbow is a special short radius piece from Wolff Aircraft. It's a 1-1/2" x 0.065" wall tube bent on a 1.5" radius. Super handy in some applications. This is actually the second attempt at this part. The first time through, I had a second mandrel bend that brought the manifold up higher and closer to the manifold. The problem was that the two hose ends that make up the right hose would have only been about 1/2" apart...not good. So after some profanity, I cut stuff up and tried again.

I have the lower "hose" tacked together. It's made up of 1-3/4" mandrel bends, but I didn't get any pictures yet.
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  #203  
Old 04-06-2015, 04:44 PM
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Is it common practice to use two -8 lines for this cooling arrangement? Having no experience with this, it seems small since combined they'd have roughly 2/3 the flow area of the 1-1/2" radiator inlet.
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  #204  
Old 04-06-2015, 05:10 PM
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Is it common practice to use two -8 lines for this cooling arrangement? Having no experience with this, it seems small since combined they'd have roughly 2/3 the flow area of the 1-1/2" radiator inlet.
It is, but it kind of depends on the engine builder. Previously, we ran two -6's from the rear corner outlets on the injection to the radiator in addition to two -8's from the front corners. We switched engine builders and when we got the engine back, the two rear ports were teed together with the front ports, leaving only two -8's to go to the radiator. Most sprint car radiators that you buy have four ports on them (either 1/2" NPT or -8 O-ring port) so you can set the system up as you choose.

I don't think it hurts anything because the restriction in the system raises the block pressure, which should help eliminate hot spots.
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  #205  
Old 04-07-2015, 09:03 AM
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Lower water line:



Another view:



I didn't do myself any favors with the placement of where the extra water line goes through the motor plate. A 1/2" higher would have made life easier. The extra line goes to the cylinder head between the center exhaust ports. It helps with preventing steam pockets in that location.

This was relatively straightforward to do. Just like building headers, only in aluminum!

Last edited by Graham08; 04-07-2015 at 09:06 AM.
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  #206  
Old 04-07-2015, 06:15 PM
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Looking good. You do nice work. Well thought out.
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  #207  
Old 04-08-2015, 11:49 AM
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Originally Posted by deaner View Post
Looking good. You do nice work. Well thought out.
Thanks! I've been thinking about this for a while.

Last night I got a start on a screen setup to protect the radiator, since I need a couple fittings to finish the water plumbing.

I got to use a new tool for this. I just picked up a Ridgid 606 instrument bender, here it is in action:



This bends 3/8" x 0.035" wall 304 tubing without issue. Ridgid rates it for stainless and titanium. The bender is really well made, with rollers on the follower instead of bronze. My only complaint in the country of origin. I opened the box to find it (and it's little brother 603 that I bought previously) is made in China. Part of the reason I look for Ridgid tools is partially to help support my regional economy (they're also based here in northeast Ohio)...but enough politics/economics.

Here's the frame for the radiator screen. I have to add tabs to attach it to the car, then I can form and weld stainless screen to it:



I had the welder set at a whopping 30 amps to weld this up, and was using straightened 0.030" 308 MIG wire for filler.
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  #208  
Old 04-08-2015, 12:00 PM
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Awesome work as usual. How are you going to attach the screen? When I made my little rock guard I just TIGd the end of each piece of wire to the frame. It took forever. Im not certain how strong it is but for a street car it was good enough.




Man that bender does an awesome job. Too bad they dont go up to 3/4", would be perfect for smaller water lines etc.


EDIT: How do you bead the aluminum tubes? I did mine with a pair of vise grips that I modified since they wont fit in my bead roller.

Dan

Last edited by juicedz4; 04-08-2015 at 12:04 PM.
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  #209  
Old 04-08-2015, 12:59 PM
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Originally Posted by juicedz4 View Post
Awesome work as usual. How are you going to attach the screen? When I made my little rock guard I just TIGd the end of each piece of wire to the frame. It took forever. Im not certain how strong it is but for a street car it was good enough.
Thanks!

I'm going to attach my screen pretty much the same way you did yours. The only difference being I'll brake out a pan first so it can be formed around the tube. TIG welding all the wires sucks, but I don't really know a better alternative. I went to tubing for this one because the first time I did this, I used 1/4" 304 rod, and it caused trouble welding the screen because by the time you got the rod hot enough to puddle, the end of the screen wire was wanting to melt down to nothing.

I have a couple of the Earl's tools for beading tube. They work OK, but they're slow. Here's a link: http://www.summitracing.com/parts/ear-014erl

In retrospect, I should have bought a set of dies for my bead roller. Both Mittler Bros. and Pro-Tools make them, they're a special roll set with a really small upper that has the male bead form, and a correspondingly larger lower. I have more invested in two tools than Pro-Tools gets for those dies, and it looks like they would just work on tube as small as 1-1/8" x 0.065". It would have helped me this time because the lower line was distorted a bit on the end because it was so close to the bend. I would up having to expand it a little bit to get the Earl's tool in place to use it.

Edit: A couple of my more used dies for my JD2 bender are for 1/2" and 3/4" tube. In both cases I bought them to do something specific thinking it would be a one time use deal, and it turns out there are a lot of places where it's handy to bend small-ish diameter tubing.

Last edited by Graham08; 04-08-2015 at 01:07 PM.
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  #210  
Old 04-08-2015, 01:43 PM
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I made these back in 2008. They work decent.






More recently I made a smaller inside die for my HF bead roller to do some 2" IC piping.

Its just a stack of 4 SS fender washers and a nut for spacing.


But works well enough


Dan
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  #211  
Old 04-08-2015, 02:51 PM
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I like the Vise Grips. I have several sets that I've modified to do different things. Your bead roller die does a nice job as well.
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  #212  
Old 04-10-2015, 09:39 AM
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Got the radiator screen finished up:



Nothing like making a couple hundred tiny little welds...



In the duct.



Just lacking a few screws to secure it in place. I have two hoses to make up, and the cooling system and it's accessories will be all done!
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  #213  
Old 04-15-2015, 05:59 PM
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Getting into brake lines now. This is the first time I've attempted them in stainless. So far, so good. I've got the rear circuit done, which is fairly simple because I'm just running a single inboard caliper back there.

This first picture is my solution to having something to attach the lines and other things to. I was originally going to use bicycle cable mounting lugs for this because they give a nice point to wrap a cable tie around. I found them reasonably cheap, but the cost of shipping from that supplier was outlandish. So, I made basically the same thing by taking a piece of 1/4" x 3/4" steel flat stock and cutting a 1/4" wide x 1/8" deep slot in it. I can then cut into 1/4" wide pieces to make mounting lugs.



Next is the plumbing off the rear master cylinder. The short braided hose is to accommodate the adjustment built into the brake pedal assembly, which has a series of holes drilled and tapped in the bottom to allow moving it to suit the driver. From there, I have a bulkhead fitting in a tab on the frame, and a 2 psi check valve attached to one of my mounting lugs.



The 2 psi check valve just keeps fluid from draining back into the master cylinders, since they're below the calipers. I'm not completely sure this is necessary since the reservoir is mounted up high, but I figure it won't hurt anything.

Next is the stainless hard line from the check valve to a bulkhead fitting where the hose attaches for the caliper.



This got a little interesting because I have the bulkhead fitting mounted parallel to the centerline of the car. The reason for this is it keeps the hose from getting pushed into the rear end as the suspension moves in droop.

And another shot, zoomed out a bit to show the assembly a little better.



Onto the front!
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  #214  
Old 04-16-2015, 04:35 PM
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Loving it as usual. How is flaring the SS line? I need to do brake lines on the cabriolet as well.


Your zip tie mounts made me think of these that we have been using on some of our products lately. They would probably work well if they weren't zinc coated.

http://catalog.pemnet.com/viewitems/...mounts-unified

Dan
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  #215  
Old 04-16-2015, 05:30 PM
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Originally Posted by juicedz4 View Post
Loving it as usual. How is flaring the SS line? I need to do brake lines on the cabriolet as well.


Your zip tie mounts made me think of these that we have been using on some of our products lately. They would probably work well if they weren't zinc coated.

http://catalog.pemnet.com/viewitems/...mounts-unified

Dan
Thanks!

Flaring isn't too bad because I'm using 37 degree single flares. I found a Ridgid flaring tool at a garage sale for $5, which really makes things simple. The other thing I'm doing is cutting the tube with a cutoff disc. I guess using a tubing cutter work hardens the stainless, making it harder to flare.

You're right, those mounts look pretty slick. A short dip in muriatic acid should remove the plating.
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  #216  
Old 04-16-2015, 07:40 PM
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I like the zip tie mount but I'd like it more if you had a half-moon groove for the tube to sit in.
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  #217  
Old 04-16-2015, 08:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Graham08 View Post
Thanks for the tip on a supplier for port tools. I'll eventually pick them up as required...just haven't gotten to that point yet. They're definitely an investment, but I can see how once you have them you would use them all the time.



Thanks! Great to see you on here again. Did you ever get that bad-ass kart going?
Great to see you're on a new project,,, Superkart is ready for teardown and powdercoat, then final assembly. Life got in the way with the move to Kentucky , building a new house and shop, operating my racing biz...etc. etc. 8yrs and counting ..LOL
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  #218  
Old 04-17-2015, 08:36 AM
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I like the zip tie mount but I'd like it more if you had a half-moon groove for the tube to sit in.
I like that idea. Maybe on V2.0.
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  #219  
Old 04-17-2015, 08:37 AM
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Graham08 Graham08 is offline
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Originally Posted by Dqracer View Post
Great to see you're on a new project,,, Superkart is ready for teardown and powdercoat, then final assembly. Life got in the way with the move to Kentucky , building a new house and shop, operating my racing biz...etc. etc. 8yrs and counting ..LOL
Actually, that sounds really similar to how this project has gone. I've done two complete cars for other people, moved, and built a new shop since I started building it, way back when.
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  #220  
Old 05-26-2015, 02:42 PM
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Finally an update! I've been sidelined from doing pretty much anything by a herniated disc for the better part of a month. I don't recommend it to anyone. I never thought I would be so thankful to be able to sit or stand without pain.

At any rate, I got back to work on the car, heading down the path of getting the fuel system all set up, when I realized I had to pull the engine to drill the motor plate so I could bolt the fuel pump to it. One thing led to another, and I decided to finish up a bunch of stuff that's just easier to do when you're working with a bare frame.

First up was to finish welding everything on the bottom of the car. There were a number of joints that weren't easily accessible when the car was assembled, so that got taken care of first:



I'm hoping it doesn't end up in this position again for a long time!

Next up was getting the floor pan attached to the car. I made up the mounting tabs out of 1.5" x 0.095" thick strip, and scalloped everything out to save a few ounces, but support the sheet metal around its perimeter. The tabs are set up for #10-32 aircraft nut plates so fumbling around with nuts is kept to a minimum.



Floor pan in place:



Eventually a pair of heel risers will get added, but the height and exact placement are TBD based on driver preference.

I'm currently working on the belly pans. I decided to go with the "old school" approach and make them actual pans that wrap up the side of the chassis instead of flat panels on the bottom of the car. The top edge is stepped so the side panels will lap over and share Dzus plates. Here's the rear section completed:



There's a single Dzus button in the center of the bottom, at the front and rear edges. The front pan will lap over the step at the front of the rear section. I formed these using a radius die I made up for my finger brake a while back that uses 1" round bar as the bending edge.

After doing this, I see why newer cars have simple flat panels on the bottom...these are a ton of work to make! The finished product came out pretty slick, though, so it's worth the effort.

More coming soon...
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