Go Back OFN Forums > Shop and Tool Talk > Benders and Bending

Benders and Bending Which bender is best? How do you use a bender? How do you calculate bends? Everything Bender related...


Benders and Bending Which bender is best? How do you use a bender? How do you calculate bends? Everything Bender related...

Reply
 
Thread Tools
  #21  
Old 06-04-2015, 02:41 PM
350 Vortec's Avatar
350 Vortec 350 Vortec is offline
Master Fabricator
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Ireland
Posts: 487
I would say horizontal is most used for me,my ram is small at 40mm piston and im running 180 bar,The diameter of your cylinder will determine a lot,my 40 mm dies fast with 3mmx2" once I go past max leverage point,I may change at some stage or extend the bender arms as my ram stroke is more than needed and I don't have clearance with 2" in first pin hole past approx 60deg,My system is very fast,im not sure what my flow is exactly but according to the pump manufacturer it's 11 european GPM
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 06-04-2015, 05:40 PM
Adam Gardiner's Avatar
Adam Gardiner Adam Gardiner is offline
Master Fabricator
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 140
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheBandit View Post
If you need more torque or are up against the power limits of your motor, you can mount the ram further from the center pivot. The tradeoff will be bending speed and maximum bend angle for a single stroke. Given there is such a big difference between 50mmx6mm and more typical tube sizes, you might consider designing in more than one mounting position for the ram. That would allow you to move it further out to increase leverage for high capacity tube or move it in to keep speeds/stroke up for more typical sizes.

A 3" ram at 55bar will produce about 1,900lbf. To get 7,200ft-lb, it will need to be mounted perpendicularly almost 4ft from the center pivot.
Thanks for the reply and data its very useful can i please ask how did you get to these figures please as I've found a online calculator that gave the results for a 3.2" ( approx 80mm) ram with 800 psi as 6434lb force? So was hoping that my choice in ram would work but I may have to re think if I have missed something out

Regards

Adam
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 06-04-2015, 05:50 PM
TheBandit's Avatar
TheBandit TheBandit is offline
Instagram @chevyhotrodder
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Ventura County CA
Posts: 4,353
You're right; there is an error in my calculation. I'll have to correct later. That's what I do for writing replies between work!
__________________
Clint

Sometimes you win. Sometimes you learn.
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 06-04-2015, 06:24 PM
TheBandit's Avatar
TheBandit TheBandit is offline
Instagram @chevyhotrodder
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Ventura County CA
Posts: 4,353
Pressure: 55bar =798psi
Area = pi()*D^2/4 = 3.14 * 3.2^2/4 = 8.04in^2
Force = Pressure * Area = 798 * 8.04 = 6,416lb
Torque = Force * Distance
Distance = Torque / Force = 7,200ft-lb/6,416lb = 1.12ft
__________________
Clint

Sometimes you win. Sometimes you learn.

Last edited by TheBandit; 06-04-2015 at 06:55 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 06-04-2015, 06:50 PM
Adam Gardiner's Avatar
Adam Gardiner Adam Gardiner is offline
Master Fabricator
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 140
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheBandit View Post
Pressure: 55bar =798psi
Area = pi()*D^2/4 = 3.14 * 3.2^2/4 = 8.04in^2
Force = Pressure * Area = 798 * 8.04 = 6,416lb
Torque = Force x Distance
Distance = Torque / Distance = 7,200ft-lb/6,416lb = 1.12ft
Thanks for the info I'm happy with the figures now and will hopefully start building the frame and getting the ram ASAP over the next few weeks as the time allows
Regards
Adam
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 03-31-2016, 04:15 PM
Adam Gardiner's Avatar
Adam Gardiner Adam Gardiner is offline
Master Fabricator
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 140
Back on this project now. The arms are being bored out to accept a bush. I know the diameter of ram I need just unsure of the length. What length ram do other people use to achieve 90 bend in 1 go. I was thinking of mounting the ram approx 2" off the original bender arms to increase the length slightly to clear the 2" die

Regards

Adam
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 03-31-2016, 05:20 PM
fabcam's Avatar
fabcam fabcam is offline
Site Admin
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: MN
Posts: 4,567
Got love how some of our projects get side tracked. Thanks for bringing it back.
__________________
The Designers of Bend-Tech Products
www.Bend-Tech.com
Bend-Tech Dragon web site:
http://www.BendTechDragon.com

Cris Merry
Phone: 651-257-8715
Cris@bend-tech.com

Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 03-31-2016, 06:29 PM
Adam Gardiner's Avatar
Adam Gardiner Adam Gardiner is offline
Master Fabricator
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 140
As the project stands so far

Pin modified for encoder coupling
Arms with local machine shop being bored out to accept bush.
Tank for hydraulic pump 1/2 made
Sourcing hydraulic ram prices
24v solenoid spool valve purchased
Micro controler/ display made
Stand designed will get steel and make soon
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 04-02-2016, 09:00 PM
kkroger's Avatar
kkroger kkroger is offline
Fabricator
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Missouri KC Area
Posts: 97
JD sells a mount and fitments for a real hydraulic ram, I bought their bracketry and a cylinder and then tried to cheap out on the pump and ended up buying the power team pump and hose they sell... I went AOH instead of EOH for a variety of reasons number one being I have a LOT of air... I bought an engine Stand Style stand from Trick Tools... I like it. Was in the mindset I want it all and I want it now... had the funds so I bought it.
All that aside SWAG makes a set of brackets that center up the ram instead of swinging it offset... and the HF ram has a longer stroke than I have currently. But I haven't encountered any problems with my setup other than the size of my garage....
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 04-07-2016, 03:15 PM
Adam Gardiner's Avatar
Adam Gardiner Adam Gardiner is offline
Master Fabricator
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 140
Quote:
Originally Posted by kkroger View Post
JD sells a mount and fitments for a real hydraulic ram, I bought their bracketry and a cylinder and then tried to cheap out on the pump and ended up buying the power team pump and hose they sell... I went AOH instead of EOH for a variety of reasons number one being I have a LOT of air... I bought an engine Stand Style stand from Trick Tools... I like it. Was in the mindset I want it all and I want it now... had the funds so I bought it.
All that aside SWAG makes a set of brackets that center up the ram instead of swinging it offset... and the HF ram has a longer stroke than I have currently. But I haven't encountered any problems with my setup other than the size of my garage....
Thanks for the reply I'm to far into the build to start buying JD mounts etc I've got a pump which is man enough according to my figures to bend the tube providing I use a 3" ram at 55bar, I probably won't ever bend 2" 1/4 wall tube though, I want to be able to transport the bender without taking a compressor etc.

The main reason I'm going hydraulic is I don't have the room to bolt the bender down anywhere so making it on wheels and jacking bolts to level up is the best option for me,
I also want to achieve a 90 bend without repinning etc,

I have done a few sums based on presuming that I mount the ram so it is right home when the arms are touching
I have allowed for 18" arm lengths but in reality may be shorter,
I have allowed 10 to take up pressure on pipe and 100 to be able to easily achieve 90 after spring back, so calculating it as a isosceles triangle it would be 18" arm length by 110 maximum angle which works out at approx
29.5" stroke length

Does this sound right to other people

Regards

Adam
Reply With Quote
  #31  
Old 04-08-2016, 09:22 AM
Adam Gardiner's Avatar
Adam Gardiner Adam Gardiner is offline
Master Fabricator
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 140
Name:  2016-04-08 13.12.52-240x258.jpg
Views: 390
Size:  30.7 KB

Here is the start of the frame it will be on wheels eventually and then have removable stays which will slide up the box section diagonally from the frame if needed
Reply With Quote
  #32  
Old 05-04-2016, 11:06 AM
Adam Gardiner's Avatar
Adam Gardiner Adam Gardiner is offline
Master Fabricator
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 140
Name:  20160504_135241-640x360.jpg
Views: 346
Size:  81.2 KB

Latest photo

The display works and looks accurate will try to upload video later.
Reply With Quote
  #33  
Old 05-04-2016, 11:42 AM
TheBandit's Avatar
TheBandit TheBandit is offline
Instagram @chevyhotrodder
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Ventura County CA
Posts: 4,353
Awesome! Congratulations :)
__________________
Clint

Sometimes you win. Sometimes you learn.
Reply With Quote
  #34  
Old 05-04-2016, 03:51 PM
Adam Gardiner's Avatar
Adam Gardiner Adam Gardiner is offline
Master Fabricator
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 140
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=rW10Tm...ature=youtu.be

Here is a video of it working it does not flicker like the video shows. Once I fit the hydraulics I will tidy it all up. The stand is just for holding it in place thus won't be what im using.
Adam
Reply With Quote
  #35  
Old 06-17-2016, 02:06 PM
Adam Gardiner's Avatar
Adam Gardiner Adam Gardiner is offline
Master Fabricator
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 140
Name:  20160617_174735-800x450.jpg
Views: 298
Size:  59.8 KB
Name:  20160617_170150-800x450.jpg
Views: 298
Size:  57.0 KB

Laser cut 10mm arms

Will hopefully put a better photo up soon bolted to the bender

Adam
Reply With Quote
  #36  
Old 06-17-2016, 02:24 PM
Adam Gardiner's Avatar
Adam Gardiner Adam Gardiner is offline
Master Fabricator
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 140
The 2 short arms are extensions to the standard arms and the long arm is the mount for the ram. I'm using a 800mm stroke ram it's 1000mm overall between centers. I'm doing this to keep the pivot point at the centre of the ram. I will mirror the top and bottom extension with the addition of triangulation on the lower arms to stop the weight of the ram twisting anything.
Hoping to get it bolted to the ram this week workload depending
Adam
Reply With Quote
  #37  
Old 06-17-2016, 05:29 PM
Captainfab's Avatar
Captainfab Captainfab is offline
Master Fabricator
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Coeur d'Alene Idaho
Posts: 2,738
Looking forward to your updates :)
Reply With Quote
  #38  
Old 07-04-2016, 05:38 PM
Adam Gardiner's Avatar
Adam Gardiner Adam Gardiner is offline
Master Fabricator
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 140
Had a bit of time tonight to work on the project

Name:  20160704_201924-800x450.jpg
Views: 255
Size:  124.3 KB
This is the support arm for the back of the ram
There is a top cross bar to go with it but it won't be triangulated

Name:  20160704_200732-240x427.jpg
Views: 263
Size:  44.3 KB
This is the extension arms bolted in position
Reply With Quote
  #39  
Old 09-06-2016, 05:29 PM
Adam Gardiner's Avatar
Adam Gardiner Adam Gardiner is offline
Master Fabricator
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 140
Picked the new motor pump combo up today couldn't source a pump for the motor I have cheap enough. Got a 1.1kw 240v motor with 2.0cc pump so approx 2.8l/min flow rate. And a 6l pressed steel tank with return filter. Just got to mount the pump and tank now and get the hoses made and can try the operation fingers crossed next week we will be able to bend some tube or box section to try the mechanical side of things then I can build a control panel to integrate the display / control side of things
Reply With Quote
  #40  
Old 09-06-2016, 07:19 PM
TheBandit's Avatar
TheBandit TheBandit is offline
Instagram @chevyhotrodder
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Ventura County CA
Posts: 4,353
That should make a great power pack. Keep up the great work!
__________________
Clint

Sometimes you win. Sometimes you learn.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:17 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Template-Modifications by TMS
Copyright 2012, Offroad Fabrication Network