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  #1  
Old 01-23-2011, 03:28 PM
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Baloo Baloo is offline
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lightwieght rock crawler

hi

l have started biulding myself a little rockcrawler, well l am calling it a rock crawler but we dont really have any rocks over here in the uk but l dont know what else to call it, all we got is humps and bumps, but anyway l have posted this on our local 4 wheel drive forum but unless its a land rover its hard to get anyone to be enthusiastic and post,
l want to use a front wheel drive engine and box as its so compact and light, l can squeeze 2 seats in just about and started off using suzuki sj axles but due to the lack of availability of LSD's for sj axles l switched to toyota hilux axles, bit of a wieght penalty doing this and wont help me get under my 1600 lb target
this is what l sketched out



l am a little way into it but still finding things out and changing my mind/design









the cage is 4' tall and 4' wide, based on an sj's size really

Andy
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  #2  
Old 01-23-2011, 06:41 PM
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Looks pretty good so far. I like the tires they remind me of over sized dirt bike tires.
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  #3  
Old 01-23-2011, 07:26 PM
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Interesting. Looks like your legs might get a little toasty. It seems to me the most successful small buggies put the motor in the rear instead of the front.

Keep your posts updated. I look forward to seeing more.
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  #4  
Old 01-24-2011, 12:00 AM
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Great concept! I completely like dig it!!!
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  #5  
Old 01-24-2011, 02:28 AM
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hi

thanks for the replys guys, it will be the poor old passenger who has toasty feet as we drive on the "right" side over here lol,
but engine position is something worth disscussing as its not too late to start again as l already see several thing l would do differently
l did think about a rear engine but the way it all packages usally makes for a longer wheel base which is probally a good thing over there where you have lots of space, but here tiny would be better for down in the woods, the other thing l was wary about with rear engine ( rightly or wrongly ) is the front lifting when setting off up a steep hill, a long wheel base probally helps stop that too,
heres a couple of pics from my pals biuld thread using the same idea but with the engine further back beside the driver, if you are over enthusiastic with the throttle on a steep slope you can lift the front wheels, l thought moving the engine forward would help with this and allow room for a passenger as while a single seater is great it would be nice to show someone else what it will do sometimes








so you can see my line of thought here, l have just moved the engine forward to help keep the front down and make some space for a passenger, its also giving me equal length (ish) long propshafts,
so you guys think it would be better with the engine in the back ?
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  #6  
Old 01-24-2011, 05:21 PM
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and a couple more pics



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  #7  
Old 01-24-2011, 05:54 PM
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smosher 604 smosher 604 is offline
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if lifting the front is a concern ive seen guys put a conecting point from there winch to the front axle to compress the front suspension and keep them planted to the obsticle just some food for thought
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  #8  
Old 01-24-2011, 07:36 PM
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MasterYota MasterYota is offline
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I love the concept, but that last picture does nothing to inspire anything relating to leg room for either the driver or passenger.

I'd be considering re-doing just the side bars, to allow for moving the seats outward about 4" each. Your knees with thank you!

Otherwise, I love it!
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  #9  
Old 01-24-2011, 09:04 PM
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smosher 604 smosher 604 is offline
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i agree after a long days wheeling your gonna be hating your car if you dont design it with at least a bit of comfort in mind not to mention the weight we all put on around thwe holidays hahahaha
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  #10  
Old 01-24-2011, 09:52 PM
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JaysinSpaceman JaysinSpaceman is offline
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I love your Idea here! Super simple and as light as you can build it.

I have to agree with the others though about the leg room. By the time you get an engine cover around that engine you are going to be super cramped. Can you move the seats out and then build a "door bar" to protect the driver and passenger?

Nice work.
Jaysin
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  #11  
Old 01-25-2011, 01:03 AM
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Subscribes.

I have to see how this turns out.
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  #12  
Old 01-25-2011, 04:41 AM
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hi

foot room width ways seems ok l know it looks tight but l seem to fit ok, l was going to use the pedal box of the doner car but have since decided to junk it and make my own pedals and run with out a servo,




its really like a 3d drawing board at the moment as l keep changing things and cutting stuff on and adding it back in in adifferent place
funny you guys should pick up on the overall width as l have been looking at this, l started of with suzuki sj axles and made teh frame to match but now that l am using toy axles the frame dose look a little narrow, infact when l drop a wheel on it the wheel and tyre are completly out side the frame/cage so it would appear l could add in another 4 or 5" each side ? and still leave half the tyre sticking out,



but its hard to know when to stop adding bits in, its so easy to get carried away adding tubes and size, l want this to be small and light wieght above all else, there is room for 2 of my size 12 feet with my work boots on so really that is all thats needed, it auto or cvt to be more accurate so one foot over the accelerator and one over the brake is all the room l need ?
we dont have trails over here that we can drive for hours
( wish we did ) so l am only likerly to see 15 or 20 mins at a time so if its a bit cramped l can live with it,

marks is tiny but we all manage to drive it for short spells




http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ToMh2p8TqSU

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LM1lF1Vrfao



l have looked at many types of layout over the last year
and have come to the conclusion that the layout above ticks most boxes
had a bit of a an experiment with a subaru engine and box at one point, nice low centre of gravity as everything heavy is on the deck
nice option for loads of foot room but the passenger would have to sit on the carb

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  #13  
Old 01-25-2011, 06:02 AM
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fal308 fal308 is offline
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With the Subaru setup pictured, you could run your seats in tandem. Put your battery, fuel tank, etc where you need them to balance sided to side.
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  #14  
Old 01-25-2011, 11:57 AM
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smosher 604 smosher 604 is offline
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yeah out here in the dezert the e.m.t. have a jimco sand rail they ride tandem in and the pasenger front and rear area is for straping down a paitent on a stretcher if weight is your concern i have seen guys fill there tubing with concreete or add lead weights to balance there rear ends out dont see why this wouldent work for your subaru app
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  #15  
Old 01-25-2011, 11:58 AM
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smosher 604 smosher 604 is offline
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sorry bout that its not a jimco its a joes fab sand limo
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  #16  
Old 01-25-2011, 05:23 PM
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reminds me of the marabunta from argentina.. very cool
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Old 01-25-2011, 10:01 PM
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cornfieldracing cornfieldracing is offline
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As far as the layout goes, the way I see it, when using a front drive transaxle to power a crawler, what was the front of the engine in the donor car becomes the left side in the new buggy. The subaru pic looks backwards or maybe I am missing something. What engine/trans is in the single seater and what are you using? One of my current projects is a similar 2 seat creature using Samurai axles and a 3 cylinder Geo metro engine and auto. Even with this tiny motor the cage will be as wide as the outside of the samurai doors but not wider than the outside of the tires. It is not nearly as tiny as I hoped it would be, but it is mostly intended for my 10 year old girl to learn to wheel. I will be starting a thread on it and other projects soon.
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  #18  
Old 01-26-2011, 05:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cornfieldracing View Post
As far as the layout goes, the way I see it, when using a front drive transaxle to power a crawler, what was the front of the engine in the donor car becomes the left side in the new buggy. The subaru pic looks backwards or maybe I am missing something. What engine/trans is in the single seater and what are you using? One of my current projects is a similar 2 seat creature using Samurai axles and a 3 cylinder Geo metro engine and auto. Even with this tiny motor the cage will be as wide as the outside of the samurai doors but not wider than the outside of the tires. It is not nearly as tiny as I hoped it would be, but it is mostly intended for my 10 year old girl to learn to wheel. I will be starting a thread on it and other projects soon.
hi
yes you are right the subaru as laid out would need the diffs flipping to get the direction right or spin the engine and box round the other way

in my buggy the engine and box is out a car called a metro or rover 100

l doubt it made it over the pond to you guys ?
l chose it because they are rot boxes and there are plenty around that have failed the annual test so are sold for scrap ie cheap $100 ish, the engine is called a K sieres turns up in lots of motors and in different engine capcities from 1000cc to 1800cc, its an all alliminium engine so nice and light in the metro it also comes with a cvt gearbox which is what l have so no gearchanges to upset traction, its also fitted in the mgf which you probally do have over there, in this its an 1800cc vvc version with around 150 bhp with a very wide torque band thanks to the variable valve timing, also intresting is the steptronic gearbox that has the gear changing operated by paddles on the steering wheel so only 2 pedals to find room for .



the engine in marks single seat buggy is from a citroen bx, again chosen since it s all ally so nice and light the whole car was only $50 so he just took off what he needed and scrapped the rest, his buggy biuld is a bit different to normal in that there is no chassis in the conventional way, it has an alliminium tub that is folded up and bonded the suspension hangs off this , there is a biuld thread if you are intrested, first 10 pages or so are the crawler and the next few are his motor cycle engined 4x4 buggy, lots of engineering if you like that sort of stuff
http://forum.difflock.com/viewtopic.php?t=14499


Andy
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  #19  
Old 01-31-2011, 03:14 PM
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l managed to find some time at the week end to get a bit more done
mostly on the rear end



tried a range rover radiator just because there was one kicking about the workshop
far to big and heavy

decided to make the top shock braket a bolt on affair so as l can change it when l find out l have it in the wrong place





then l tried a rad out of a 2lt vitara, to tall the prop comes up 3" into it





so l ended up with the original metro radiator



still messing about sorting the shock location but its progress


Last edited by Baloo; 02-01-2011 at 03:34 AM.
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  #20  
Old 01-31-2011, 03:18 PM
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bent a bit more tube to form a mount for the rad pushing it backwards to leave room for the fuel tank





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