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The Lounge Its 5:00 somewhere... This is the area where, after a hard days work, you sit back, relax, and unwind...

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  #1  
Old 02-13-2016, 09:30 PM
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Tim Cameron IFS

Will this work? Way too much tire scrub? Giving up ground clearance?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jbPlqfgYzKc

Hope he keeps his thumbs out of the steering wheel.
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Old 02-13-2016, 09:58 PM
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Im speechless!
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Old 02-14-2016, 01:07 AM
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I have to say that I was pretty surprised by the geometry of that suspension myself and then he said it was R&P not full hydro and I thought exactly the same thing "better keep the thumbs out of the steering wheel spokes". I hope it works for him but it ain't the way I'd do it.

Jaysin

P.S. The KPI is literally reversed.

Last edited by JaysinSpaceman; 02-14-2016 at 01:11 AM.
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Old 02-14-2016, 05:03 AM
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certainly looks very bulky and ugly,maby he's lining up for U4 malarkey
Im sure the rack is motorised or hydraulic so fingers should be safe,that steering shaft looks like it would break before a finger anyway
Maxxis Treps are also shit on anything other than dry hard surface
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Old 02-14-2016, 09:26 AM
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And why go to all that trouble and expense to put the inner CV into the diff housing, but not put the outer CV into the wheel? He could have picked up 3 or 4 inches of axle length for free. And correct KPI. And increase ground clearance. And protect lower/outer "ball joint".
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Old 02-14-2016, 09:42 AM
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I see this video discussed on all the cool forums. I find it hard to believe Tim would reveal a car that had not been thoroughly tested in his world of off roading. I would think he has solid reasons for each design point.
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Old 02-14-2016, 02:41 PM
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When it comes to dirt nearly anything can be made to work with enough strength and power.
Mr Cameron has proven this repeatedly and put on a good show at the same time!
I want to see it run!!

Judgement reserved

E
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Old 02-15-2016, 05:14 AM
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Well I have to say I do find the rock bouncing stuff a tad crazy,as far as I can see its a case of point,shoot and just hang on,as E says maby not so necessary to have finer points right (brakes for instance 😄&#128516
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Old 02-26-2016, 03:06 PM
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Old 02-26-2016, 03:15 PM
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Quote:
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Looks really good.
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Old 02-26-2016, 04:18 PM
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Quote:
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Really enjoy the measured used of throttle. Definitely more technical/finesse than just pinning and bouncing is way up.

Maybe it's just me but the front geometry seems to do something weird at 3:43 that really highlights the reverse steering axis inclination / KPI and makes me wonder what the caster looks like too because the tires seem to camber all-kinds of backwards. I wonder if he's done that to increase steering feedback?

Wish Graham would comment on this geometry and potential reasons why they'd go this route. It has me scratching my head.
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Old 02-26-2016, 04:49 PM
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Originally Posted by TheBandit View Post
Really enjoy the measured used of throttle. Definitely more technical/finesse than just pinning and bouncing is way up.

Maybe it's just me but the front geometry seems to do something weird at 3:43 that really highlights the reverse steering axis inclination / KPI and makes me wonder what the caster looks like too because the tires seem to camber all-kinds of backwards. I wonder if he's done that to increase steering feedback?

Wish Graham would comment on this geometry and potential reasons why they'd go this route. It has me scratching my head.
I just watched both vids, not sure why you would do the outboard end of the front suspension that way.

It looks like the goofy camber gain is because the long arm is on the top. The upper mounts are inboard of the lower on the inner side, and the outers are basically parallel...like you guys pointed out, I think the KPI is backwards.

Normally, on a front wheel drive, or the front end of a four wheel drive, you shoot for negative scrub radius so if you lose traction on one side, it steers the front wheel with grip out (away from center), which tries to minimize it driving the car into a spin. This is the opposite.

Karts have big scrub radius, but it's combined with big KPI and big caster to unload the inside rear wheel to make the car turn better. They have live rear axles and will push like crazy if both rear tires are planted.

Not sure if this was done on purpose, or just fitting available parts in the available space.

Looks like fun, though! Not sure I would want to go super fast with it.
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Old 02-26-2016, 04:58 PM
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Maybe they designed it to roll over and drive upside-down like one of those fancy RC cars at the toy store :)
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Old 02-26-2016, 05:04 PM
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Maybe they designed it to roll over and drive upside-down like one of those fancy RC cars at the toy store :)
That would be awesome.
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Old 02-26-2016, 06:13 PM
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The very first shot of it at speed in the beginning of the video it looks REALLY squirrelly. The first time I saw it I though he was maybe he was dodging holes or something but then I watched it 2 or 3 more times and it just seem to me to go where ever it wants and he has to bring it back, which is exactly how I would think a suspension like that would act. Drive a gokart with really bad scrub and vertical KPI and it feels just like this rig looks at speed.

Jaysin
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  #16  
Old 02-27-2016, 09:41 AM
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Just thinking(sometimes a bad idea.) Maybe he designed the kpi so when the front drops over a rock or over a ledge the tire doesn't ride on its edge/corner of the tread when you turn the wheel?????? I commend him on trying new ideas and geometry.
Build a car tight on the road and it will push in the dirt, been there done that. What's needed to go faster up rock and ledges who knows.
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Old 04-01-2016, 01:20 PM
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That then this was quick!

https://youtu.be/u3ulXB3Zyko
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Old 04-01-2016, 02:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by entropy View Post
That then this was quick!

https://youtu.be/u3ulXB3Zyko
I know.
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Old 04-01-2016, 02:48 PM
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So what happened? That goofy IFS geometry didn't work out so he want back to a solid axle? Or are these two different buggies for two different purposes?
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Old 04-01-2016, 03:36 PM
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What I got from his explanation was the IFS worked too good absorbing bumps. It didn't bounce enough for his style driving.
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