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The Lounge Its 5:00 somewhere... This is the area where, after a hard days work, you sit back, relax, and unwind...


The Lounge Its 5:00 somewhere... This is the area where, after a hard days work, you sit back, relax, and unwind...

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  #1  
Old 11-28-2014, 10:55 AM
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Things that Car-makers do they should not

You know the little things that Car-makers do, that no self-respecting mechanic or quality builder, (like here on the OFN) would ever do things like...

Installing “Tamper-proof Screws ANYWHERE on any Motor vehicle.

Covering any part of an engine with plastic cladding just to cover up all of the really interesting bits of the engine. What good is a DOHC 4-valve engine if there is a bunch of freeking plastic covering the entire engine from view?!?

Not being satisfied with the ubiquitous “Tamper Proof Torx screws” NO, use a “Tamper Proof ‘Star’ 5-point screw” and on a part that you know will require maintenance!

Using special reduced hex head fasteners, which when lost can not be replaced, except for at the Dealer and designing the part so that nothing else can be used.

Using 6 different sized bolts to hold some component in place so that something like a change of spark plugs or glow plugs now takes at least 4x longer then it should!

Stuff the engine back under the windshield so far that several maintenance procedures will require lifting the body or completely removing the body because you refuse to build access panels...

What gets to you?
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Old 11-28-2014, 11:08 AM
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planned obsolescence.
"they" don't want you to work on your vehicle as it takes away sales.
"they" want work for their dealerships mechanics.

ps; I'm not answering your question, just commenting on your observations.
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Old 11-28-2014, 12:47 PM
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Originally Posted by alwaysFlOoReD View Post
planned obsolescence.
"they" don't want you to work on your vehicle as it takes away sales.
"they" want work for their dealerships mechanics.

ps; I'm not answering your question, just commenting on your observations.
Totally goofball thread and your comments are spot on
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Old 11-29-2014, 12:01 AM
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Oil filters behind, under, directly next to exhaust manifolds / wiring / tube or buried so deep you can't get to them and when you finally crack them loose, they dump a quart of oil onto wires and tubing that creates a drip path in all directions. Pretty soon it's raining oil-magedon and no matter how hard you try to clean all that crap off, the first start burns off a nasty cloud of smoke and the goo is on everything for the life of the car.

Push/snap together panels with hidden attachment points, often removable only by breaking (intentionally or not).

Seatbelt alarms that ding when you get in before you have any time to prevent them.

Automatic locking doors that lock at odd times. Double button press to open more than driver's door (how many times has my wife tried the handle before it was actually unlocked).

Trunk remote open buttons that seem to go off on their own.

Slightly mis-matched paint color between metal and plastic body components (looks real bad on the brand new white minivan my wife got; do they not paint these in one go?)
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Old 11-29-2014, 01:28 AM
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Screws into plastic on parts that will need to be removed for regular maintenance, these inevitably strip out.

Not just poorly placed oil filters, but all filters should be placed in accessible locations. I recently replaced a fuel filter that was under the intake manifold with the accessory drive in front of and the fire wall behind. Took me 45 minutes to remove and 50+ minutes to replace because it was impossible to get the sealing washers on the banjo bolt fittings with only on hand.

Cables that are impossible to lubricate without removing half of the vehicle.

The use of any security fasteners. It is my vehicle I must be allowed to perform any maintenance myself.

Fasteners with metric threads and imperial heads (or vice versa).

Plastic headlight lenses that fog/yellow in 20,000 miles and cost more then the car to replace.

Seat belt alarms the cannot be disabled in work trucks. It drives me insane when you need to move across a job site and the seatbelt alarm blares the entire time. Really I just can't stand seatbelt alarms, period. A light on the dash is more then enough.

Instrument lights that cannot be sufficiently dimmed. I want to see the deer standing in the dark road far more then the 100k watt dashboard.

Factory service manuals that are the same price as I paid for the vehicle itself.

I'm sure there are 100 more but that's what I got right now.

Jaysin
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Old 11-29-2014, 06:16 AM
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I've always said that if I ever start a car company, every engineer and designer will be required to dismantle and rebuild the cars. I also would try to use only a handful of fasteners in sizes that are easily available. Heck, I think it would be cool to make a car that only used ONE size fastener for everything outside of the drivetrain internals. It might be a bit silly to use a 1/2" bolt to hold the stereo or body panels on, but you could literally do all the work on the car with 1 tool, which would come with the car.

The one I came up on today was working on a 3rd Gen 4runner where the key was stuck in the ignition because of the stupidly complicated "park lock system" that uses a linkage of plastic parts, switches and "not long enough" pin that all have to line up. I tore it apart and put it back together 4 times, but after one cycle of the shifter it would just pop apart every time. Ended up just unplugging the whole control box and the key comes out, but now you can shift it into neutral without the key in.

Other ones I've come up against are cars that require taking body panels off to get at parts that frequently need replacing like lamps.

Vehicles that have the oil filter pointing down, guaranteeing you will get oil all over everything.

Body clips are just stupid in general. Plus, they are stupid expensive to replace (or the cheap ones break installing them).

Diagnostic codes in general...or rather blasting out the code but not giving any indication of what specific thing caused it out of the 100+ possibilities.

Multiple types of fasteners on the same part of the vehicle. I've seen a transmission where the top bolts were metric, the middle ones standard, and the bottom torx.

I'm sure there are others, and I might have repeated what others said too.

Last edited by Haku; 11-29-2014 at 06:24 AM.
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Old 11-29-2014, 11:53 PM
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I want to add that any system that can be simplified should be simplified. Like windshield wipers, they DO NOT need computer control, a simple electro-mechanical system works just fine and doesn't cost a small fortune. Power seats also DO NOT need computers of their own

I totally agree with Haku, a fault code should be specific. Current vehicle on-board diagnostics have the computing power of the space shuttle why in the hell can't it actually point me to the sensor that is causing the fault. For that matter it should give me a print out of the fault, the test procedure and the repair procedure.

Don't worry I'll come up with more.
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Old 11-30-2014, 01:33 AM
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The plastic trim and bumpers are painted in a totally seperate department than the body. Then all the parts get put together somewhere else


Steve
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Old 11-30-2014, 07:27 AM
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YEAH it is a joke the way they do things.I have been and automotive an light truck technician for over 20 years.The job keeps getting harder to do and the price of quality tools has doubled since I first started wrenching,but the pay has not doubled.The most screwed up thing I dealt with was a later model Dakota that has the windshield washer motor run through a module.The customer payed a hefty price to have his washer pump work again.Totally stupid.The problem is that the engineers never worked on a car or truck a day in their life.One guy designs one thing,another guy designs that thing and they hope it all works or fits together.
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Old 12-01-2014, 12:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XJ OFFROADER View Post
The problem is that the engineers never worked on a car or truck a day in their life. One guy designs one thing,another guy designs that thing and they hope it all works or fits together.
Add to that the fact that the corporate structure of all of them is, giving the do nothing stock holders their primary focus and every decision is made with the focus on monetary return to the stockholder first rather then doing the right thing by the customer first, then the company, and dead last the big company investment corporations.

Ah well I guess that explains why we have not bought a new vehicle in about 20 years AND have no plans to buy a new car/truck in the next 20 years
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Old 12-01-2014, 05:07 PM
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My Dad used to have a 1970 Ford LTD that blew the heater core. You open the hood, find the 2 hose going to the core and then take out the 4 sheet metal screws holding the panel that holds the heater cor in its box. Install in reverse 1/2 hr. Heater core goes on my Dakota pickup. 8 hrs of AC disconnect to pretty much bash removal. Bottom line make an access plate with a plate, Heater cores go bad. I can't imagine what it is like with the new vehicles with LCD screens and all. Jim
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Old 12-01-2014, 05:14 PM
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In the new cars you just teleport the heater core right out of the car and teleport the replacement back in - really saves time.

Also I think there are some new OBD4 programmers were you just program in the new heater core.
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Old 12-01-2014, 06:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by redidbull View Post
My Dad used to have a 1970 Ford LTD that blew the heater core. You open the hood, find the 2 hose going to the core and then take out the 4 sheet metal screws holding the panel that holds the heater cor in its box. Install in reverse 1/2 hr. Heater core goes on my Dakota pickup. 8 hrs of AC disconnect to pretty much bash removal. Bottom line make an access plate with a plate, Heater cores go bad. I can't imagine what it is like with the new vehicles with LCD screens and all. Jim
Our 94 Ranger was almost that easy...
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Old 12-01-2014, 06:56 PM
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In the new cars you just teleport the heater core right out of the car and teleport the replacement back in - really saves time.

Also I think there are some new OBD4 programmers were you just program in the new heater core.
That was true yesterday however they updated the OS today and it is not backwards compatible all those OBD4 vehicles must now be returned to the Federal re-purposing sites to be remade into toothbrushes.

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Old 01-02-2015, 12:29 PM
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Question What if they made an example for this thread

Ok, this car is a brilliant example of what this thread is about.
This is one of the stupidest cars I have ever seen.
A complete failure of Design and Engineering!

I watched the Video a while ago and I'm still

http://youtu.be/jTNKiTrX0Vk
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Old 01-02-2015, 01:10 PM
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Thats sad. They never turned it on and drove it either. Scary death trap.
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Old 01-02-2015, 01:43 PM
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I now give thanx to the girl who sold me her 90YJ....
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Old 01-02-2015, 02:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by entropy View Post
Ok, this car is a brilliant example of what this thread is about.
This is one of the stupidest cars I have ever seen.
A complete failure of Design and Engineering!

I watched the Video a while ago and I'm still

http://youtu.be/jTNKiTrX0Vk
Holy shit man. One example after another of WTF were these "engineers" thinking?
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Old 01-02-2015, 02:41 PM
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I do not think that the OFN is the target market
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Old 01-02-2015, 02:51 PM
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Apparently not! I do really like the styling of that car, but it seems Rube Goldberg did the engineering.
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